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Display Name Post: Keto Experiment        (Topic#38027)
JDII
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Total Posts: 7084
07-26-22 07:44 AM - Post#920682    



So over the last couple of months I've been reading about different weight loss type "programs", some I've tried and knew a lot about and some that I've heard of but never tried and A LOT that were pure BS. The one thing I kept coming back to was Keto. Now I know a bit about Keto and I knew a couple of people that tried it. Keto is one of those things that there are people that love it and people that hate it and then there are people like me that look at it skeptically but TRY to have an open mind. I've always been the type of person that believes that I should to give something an honest attempt before i pass judgement, either good or bad (for most things but not all). This is one of those things. I did a lot of reading on the subject both pro and con and I specifically looked at Keto's affects on weight training. So after all that I decided that I would give it an honest attempt, at least for a while (not sure how long I will do this), and see what the results are. I am currently on week 2, day 3 of this little experiment so I really haven't hit that Ketosis level quite yet. I've continued to train and so far doesn't seem to have any negative impact. I will admit it takes a lot to get used to eating the Keto way and I'm not sure that I like it but I will press on. If anyone is interested I will post occasional updates an my over all view of it. I also just happen to have a doc appointment in early Aug so we'll see if it has any affect on my blood work, blood pressure, weight, etc.
 
Steve Rogers
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Total Posts: 5934
07-26-22 08:48 AM - Post#920686    



Good luck with the experiment! I'll look forward to following it. As far training, there seems to be a lot of variation in effects. When my wife and I tried it in the 1980s, she had "keto flu" symptoms and reduced energy but I felt great and had plenty of energy.
"Coyote is always waiting, and Coyote is always hungry."


 
davidcc
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Total Posts: 54
07-26-22 10:03 AM - Post#920692    



I'm looking forward to hearing about your experience with keto. Although I've always been very skeptical about "diets" that eliminate whole food groups, many people report great success with keto...not only with weight loss but also with the improvement of other health issues. Good luck.
 
Brian Hassler
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Total Posts: 562
07-26-22 11:42 AM - Post#920694    



Thanks for posting. I, also, am looking forward to following your results.
 
Justin Jordan
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Total Posts: 837
07-26-22 01:52 PM - Post#920695    



I end up keto by default, in order to keep my blood sugar more or less under control.

It does that, although I can't say I've noticed any particular benefits or drawbacks otherwise.

(Which is a pretty big otherwise - the blood sugar thing has a lot of effects I can feel, aside from long term health stuff)
 
Jordan D
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Total Posts: 699
07-26-22 02:46 PM - Post#920697    



I purposefully got really fat (for me) once, gaining 60lb in 12 weeks. 6,000-7,000 calories a day. Lost it all in roughly the same time frame basically just with keto, walking, and swimming.

To this day, I’m not sure which was more extreme, or if any part of it could be considered healthy.
 
Pepper
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Total Posts: 288
07-26-22 03:55 PM - Post#920699    



Good luck with the experiment, JDII!

And Jordan, don't let us hanging. Why did you get fat on purpose?
 
JDII
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Total Posts: 7084
07-26-22 04:15 PM - Post#920700    



Thanks everyone. I have many concerns that you all do, specifically the restrictive nature of keto, which I have never been a fan of. But we’ll see where this goes.
 
Jordan D
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Total Posts: 699
07-26-22 05:23 PM - Post#920701    



  • Pepper Said:

And Jordan, don't let us hanging. Why did you get fat on purpose?



Ha. A misguided combination of GOMAD, powerlifting, and a curiosity about what life as a sumo wrestler might feel like. It didn’t work. I didn’t get strong. I just got fat and sick.

Ranks up there with my vegetarian experiment as the stupidest health-related experiences of my life.
 
JPS2019
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Total Posts: 16
Re: Keto Experiment
07-27-22 08:49 AM - Post#920711    



Loop
  • JDII Said:
I am currently on week 2, day 3 of this little experiment so I really haven't hit that Ketosis level quite yet.



I would think after a week without carbs/minimal carbs, you would be in ketosis. Are you testing blood or urine? Eating vegetables and protein with plenty of fats?
 
JDII
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Total Posts: 7084
Re: Keto Experiment
07-27-22 10:56 AM - Post#920712    



  • JPS2019 Said:
Loop
  • JDII Said:
I am currently on week 2, day 3 of this little experiment so I really haven't hit that Ketosis level quite yet.



I would think after a week without carbs/minimal carbs, you would be in ketosis. Are you testing blood or urine? Eating vegetables and protein with plenty of fats?



I haven’t tested blood or urine. From what I read is that a person usually just ketosis after about 2 weeks, so I probably misspoke. As far as my carb/fats/protein intake. As of today My daily average is about 20-25g carbs, 140-150 fats, 160 protein. So I’m hitting good numbers
 
DanMartin
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Total Posts: 20618
07-27-22 01:02 PM - Post#920715    



I think the Keto diet is a great way to overcome the initial inertia of weight loss. YMMV
Mark it Zero.


 
Andy Mitchell
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Total Posts: 5236
Keto Experiment
07-27-22 09:50 PM - Post#920746    



  • DanMartin Said:
I think the Keto diet is a great way to overcome the initial inertia of weight loss. YMMV



Yes!
I believe it…
Nice legs-shame about the face




Edited by Andy Mitchell on 07-27-22 09:51 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
 
JDII
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Total Posts: 7084
07-29-22 05:40 AM - Post#920773    



Keto experiment 2 week update:

Today is the 2 week mark.
I feel pretty good, not sluggish or run down. Energy level is pretty good, not through the roof but not lagging either. My training hasn’t suffered really but I will admit that I may have lost a little strength, but that could be just “one of those workouts” that we all experience from time to time. I’ll see how that looks moving forward
My starting weight was 172.8 and this morning I am at 171.8, so I lost 1 pound. Not that I was expecting any massive weight loss but I will admit I was expecting a bit more than a pound, Little disappointing TBH but I’m not devastated or feeling defeated. I really am just at the end of the beginning so I’m hoping that I see some progress.
My macros have been pretty consistent. Average, 20-25g carbs (27g was my highest day), 135-140g fat, 160-170 protein. So I seem to be a good track there.
I will admit that I’m still trying to get used to eating the keto way. Pretty much going against most things I’ve done but I think I have the hang of it now.

Still two weeks to go so hopefully I will now hit my keto stride. 10 Aug will be the final day of this little experiment. As I said earlier I just happen to have my annual doc appointment where they do a complete blood work up. So then I can get a good comparison ]. Whatever the outcome is I will make a determination then if I will adjust if needed and continue or move on to something else

Thanks everyone for your support!

 
Jordan D
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Total Posts: 699
07-29-22 11:35 AM - Post#920776    



Your calories are just about right for a half pound to a pound a week of fat loss. You could be a little more aggressive. Even if you weren’t eating keto-style, I’d expect similar results in terms of fat loss. But eating this way will probably give you significantly better blood work, up to a point.

Interested to see the final results!
 
JDII
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Total Posts: 7084
08-06-22 08:35 AM - Post#920962    



So a brief update. A few more days until this little 4 week experiment is over which is 10 Aug, and I’m not feeling it. Little stomach issues, maybe due to the lack of fiber (I’ve been take fiber supplements) but I can’t say for sure. I’ve stayed on track, no cheating and been tracking my carb/fat/protein intake pretty closely. Averaging daily 20-25 carbs, 130-140 fat and 170-180 protein. I’ll be honest however, I’m sort of looking forward to the end date it’s getting old, lol! But I’ll stay on track and press on
 
Old Miler
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Total Posts: 1735
08-06-22 10:29 AM - Post#920970    



Interesting to hear about your journey, thanks. I did about the same four weeks back, for 2 weeks, mostly to see what it felt like. One thing I did was to order some keto sticks off Amazon - five quid, next day delivery - to know when I got into ketosis, and it turned out that was on day 3, but we dieted pretty hard the first 2 days.

Neither my wife nor I "felt very different", apart from being a lot less able or willing to do intense, sustained work (e.g. run fast), but I sure as hell lost stomach fat quickly.
 
DanMartin
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Total Posts: 20618
08-06-22 01:17 PM - Post#920974    



  • Old Miler Said:
Interesting to hear about your journey, thanks. I did about the same four weeks back, for 2 weeks, mostly to see what it felt like. One thing I did was to order some keto sticks off Amazon - five quid, next day delivery - to know when I got into ketosis, and it turned out that was on day 3, but we dieted pretty hard the first 2 days.

Neither my wife nor I "felt very different", apart from being a lot less able or willing to do intense, sustained work (e.g. run fast), but I sure as hell lost stomach fat quickly.



I had a similar journey. Getting the fat loss started is what I think Keto does best, but...so would the 3 day "Tuna and Water" diet. That said, Keto is more fun.
Mark it Zero.


 
PulledPork
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Total Posts: 72
08-07-22 02:56 PM - Post#920990    



I agree with what DanMartin said (at least his statement mirrors my experience of one). I did low carb for 6 months (with cheat days about once every two weeks or on work trips). It worked up until a point. I started off at 187 and went down about 10 lbs (had some weight swings in there), but felt really run down by the end, had lots of little nagging injuries, and plateaued on my weight loss. Body fat went down from about 20% to 18.5% (as measured on a handheld scale, so I don’t know how accurate that is).

Good things: got better at making sure I eat colorful veggies as part of my diet (help with satiety) and imbued those habits into my routine. Additionally, it helped me cut out most of the junk on my diet. Plus it definitely kickstarted the weight loss. I got a decent idea of foods that make me feel good and foods that don’t react well.

Bad things: as mentioned, a lot of little nagging injuries, culminating in a grade 2 hamstring tear. I don’t think the low carb was a direct cause of the injury, but I do think the fatigue and low muscle glycogen levels contributed to it.

 
pink.pixie
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Total Posts: 5342
Keto Experiment
08-08-22 08:22 AM - Post#921005    



  • Jordan D Said:
  • Pepper Said:

And Jordan, don't let us hanging. Why did you get fat on purpose?



Ha. A misguided combination of GOMAD, powerlifting, and a curiosity about what life as a sumo wrestler might feel like. It didn’t work. I didn’t get strong. I just got fat and sick.

Ranks up there with my vegetarian experiment as the stupidest health-related experiences of my life.



Q: Hi Jordan, I am curious where did it leave you? Omnivore while keeping an eye on cals and nutrients? No junk and no alcohol? Possibly an occasional feast?




Aut viam inveniam aut faciam.


 
Henry
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Total Posts: 1316
08-08-22 09:32 AM - Post#921011    




I saw a youtube way back where the trainer sez to kick-start fat loss was to go zero carbs but only for 5 days.

"Go Henry - Live, lift, learn and grow - Never quit - Dave Draper"


 
Jordan D
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Total Posts: 699
Re: Keto Experiment
08-08-22 09:35 AM - Post#921012    



  • pink.pixie Said:
  • Jordan D Said:
  • Pepper Said:

And Jordan, don't let us hanging. Why did you get fat on purpose?



Ha. A misguided combination of GOMAD, powerlifting, and a curiosity about what life as a sumo wrestler might feel like. It didn’t work. I didn’t get strong. I just got fat and sick.

Ranks up there with my vegetarian experiment as the stupidest health-related experiences of my life.



Q: Hi Jordan, I am curious where did it leave you? Omnivore while keeping an eye on cals and nutrients? No junk and no alcohol? Possibly an occasional feast?




Yep! You hit the nail on the head. In my home, I only eat meat, vegetables, fruit, and nuts. When I’m having a social dinner outside the home, I eat whatever. Bread, alcohol, ice cream. I don’t actually consider any of this real food. More like a “hunger satiating drug.” But I do think the social/feast aspect is equally important to being a good human.

If I want to gain muscle, I add rice, potatoes, and/or raw milk. If I want to lose body fat, I set my calories 100-200 below maintenance. I don’t like thinking about calories/macros too much, but it’s too powerful a tool to ignore.

The strange thing about those earlier experiences is that they didn’t increase my empathy for fat people or extreme vegans. The exact opposite, in fact. Both experiences were utterly miserable and I can’t understand them anymore. Like speaking a foreign language. It’s frustrating, and something I need to reconcile.
 
Justin Jordan
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Total Posts: 837
08-08-22 08:24 PM - Post#921032    



For most fat people, overeating is the opposite of miserable.

I mean, cilantro tastes like soap to me, but I am aware that other people's experience is different, so I don't think 'I can't understand why all these people like eating soap'.
 
JDII
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Total Posts: 7084
Keto Experiment
08-09-22 04:31 AM - Post#921040    



So today is the last full day of my Keto experiment, here are some take always based on my experience.

-so I remained true to the keto principles , disciplined and didn’t cheat, which I’m somewhat proud of. Average macros over the last 4 weeks , 20-25 carbs (I think my highest carb day was 27g). 140-150 fat, 170-180 protein
-stomach issues. About week 3 I started experience some stomach issues. I’m nearly 100% positive it’s from lack of fiber. I stared taking a fiber supplement. Hindsight is that I should have started a fiber supplement from the get go
-weight loss: not really much here. Starting weight was 172.8 and as of this morning 170.8. Wasn’t expecting any magic here but I was expecting a bit more than 2 lbs in 4 weeks.
-I will admit it was fairly nice to eat what we consider “bad” butter, ghee, bacon, heavy whipping cream, etc etc.
-on the flip side even though I’m not a big carb eater to begin with most of my carbs come from veggies. However evens with veggies I couldn’t just go “overboard” had to keep the carbs in the 20-30 range. I prefer to eat veggies but I also prefer to eat as much as I want.
-all-in-alll I’m glad I did it but I’m pretty glad that it’s over. Though I realize that all “diets” are restrictive by the fact that you are restricting something, time, calories, carbs whatever. However Keto was a bit too stringent for me. My advice to other that may want to try is give it an honest attempt to see for yourself but for me it’s not my cup of tea, I didn’t like it and , again for me, wasn’t as affective as something like Intermittent Fasting, which IMO, is better way of “dieting”. It allows you to eat want you like (obviously within reason) during your eating window. It works better than anything I’ve tried

Tomorrow I get blood work done so I’ll have another update. Thanks to everyone for their support and interest in my little experiment

Edited by JDII on 08-09-22 04:35 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
 
JDII
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Total Posts: 7084
08-10-22 04:18 PM - Post#921092    



Well had my blood work today. No significant change from last year. So I think this caps it. Keto may work awesome for some people but it’s not for me…back to what I know works for me, Intermittent Fasting
 
pink.pixie
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Total Posts: 5342
Re: Keto Experiment
08-10-22 04:58 PM - Post#921096    



  • Jordan D Said:

Yep! You hit the nail on the head. In my home, I only eat meat, vegetables, fruit, and nuts. When I’m having a social dinner outside the home, I eat whatever. Bread, alcohol, ice cream. I don’t actually consider any of this real food. More like a “hunger satiating drug.” But I do think the social/feast aspect is equally important to being a good human.

If I want to gain muscle, I add rice, potatoes, and/or raw milk. If I want to lose body fat, I set my calories 100-200 below maintenance. I don’t like thinking about calories/macros too much, but it’s too powerful a tool to ignore.

The strange thing about those earlier experiences is that they didn’t increase my empathy for fat people or extreme vegans. The exact opposite, in fact. Both experiences were utterly miserable and I can’t understand them anymore. Like speaking a foreign language. It’s frustrating, and something I need to reconcile.



Thanks. That makes a lot of sense to me.
Aut viam inveniam aut faciam.


 
iPood
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Total Posts: 2307
Re: Keto Experiment
08-11-22 02:20 AM - Post#921101    



  • Jordan D Said:
Yep! You hit the nail on the head. In my home, I only eat meat, vegetables, fruit, and nuts.



No fish whatsoever?
"I think we often spend too much time focusing on max fitness
and not nearly enough on maintaining our minimums.
It seems we need to think sustainable rather than obtainable.
Meaning whatever we do today, we can do it again tomorrow.
Never taking so much from ourselves that we can't."

Dan Martin


 
Jordan D
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Total Posts: 699
Re: Keto Experiment
08-11-22 11:47 AM - Post#921108    



  • iPood Said:
  • Jordan D Said:
Yep! You hit the nail on the head. In my home, I only eat meat, vegetables, fruit, and nuts.



No fish whatsoever?



Lots of fish. Mostly local now, because I ate so much farmed fish it gave me lead/mercury poisoning a few years ago.
 
Diablo
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Total Posts: 7181
Keto Experiment
08-12-22 02:40 AM - Post#921125    



I was especially interested in this one. Thank you, JD.

Of all the variables this one really tells the tale (for you of course) I feel is most pertinent, to me. When reading accounts in other places it's really easy to be left with questions.

What about that whole "it makes the mind sharper" thing I've read here and there? I guess you would have made a note of it. It just seems rather prevalent at times when you come across keto stuff in writeups.

  • JDII Said:
Well had my blood work today. No significant change from last year. So I think this caps it. Keto may work awesome for some people but it’s not for me…back to what I know works for me, Intermittent Fasting


Diablo

Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth- MT




Edited by Diablo on 08-12-22 02:41 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
 
JDII
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Total Posts: 7084
Re: Keto Experiment
08-12-22 04:29 AM - Post#921127    



  • Diablo Said:
I was especially interested in this one. Thank you, JD.

Of all the variables this one really tells the tale (for you of course) I feel is most pertinent, to me. When reading accounts in other places it's really easy to be left with questions.

What about that whole "it makes the mind sharper" thing I've read here and there? I guess you would have made a note of it. It just seems rather prevalent at times when you come across keto stuff in writeups.

  • JDII Said:
Well had my blood work today. No significant change from last year. So I think this caps it. Keto may work awesome for some people but it’s not for me…back to what I know works for me, Intermittent Fasting





Thanks Diablo. No I didn’t feel any “sharper” or more focused. There might be claims by Keto people that are true backed by evidence and facts however the claim of being sharper mentally based on a diet I personally believe is bullshit
 
Justin Jordan
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Total Posts: 837
Re: Keto Experiment
08-12-22 09:11 AM - Post#921133    



  • JDII Said:

Thanks Diablo. No I didn’t feel any “sharper” or more focused. There might be claims by Keto people that are true backed by evidence and facts however the claim of being sharper mentally based on a diet I personally believe is bullshit



I suspect this is very context dependent. True keto diets absolutely do things to your brain - the original point of them was to reduce seizures - but what you might subjective feel is going to vary from person to person.

If you've got blood sugar issues, I suspect you're a loooot more likely to notice something. If your blood sugar control is normal and you don't get into heavy ketosis, likely to be meh.

As a somewhat related example, I don't feel any different fasting than I do any other time I'm keeping my blood sugar under control, mentally. I do believe Dan when he says he does though.
 
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