04-11-19 06:09 PM - Post#880820    

Hello all,

I've decided to post here as I thought some people may find it interesting to see what it is like to go through the MMS program a second time, eight years later when you are in your early 30s. The first time through is posted here:

https://www.davedraper.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/26363/pid//

The first time I did this, I was in college finishing up a Master's with lots of time and food. Now, I am a partner in a number of small real-estate related businesses with four children ages 6 and under. Yes, a lot can change in 8 years.

So, basically, this thread is meant to be (1) motivation for me, as I really enjoyed the feedback last time I posted here and (2) a bit of information on what it is like to do this program in the "real world."

I've just finished up Day 6 of the program, but I've been taking notes on the way through as prescribed by Dan.

Deviations from the program:
-I am doing this in a basement gym. It's a great spot, but equipment is more limited. Specifically, I have no dumbbells and an assortment of kettlebells in relatively large weight jumps. This limits weight choices for the bat wings and one arm presses, as I'll note going forward.
-Tweaks: As I've done the program before, I'm starting the tweaks that I noted worked well for me early in the program. Specifically, I am doing nightly protein and 10g creatine from the beginning.





Edited by Dex on 04-11-19 06:27 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

04-11-19 06:34 PM - Post#880821    

Day 1

Starting weight: 200.8,

Bench: Settled at a weight of 225.

Bat Wings: 50ish KBs (one 53, one 50) felt slightly heavy, but that's the lightest "pair" I have. So, sticking with these.

One Arm Press: Settled with the 53lb KB. This was pretty easy, but 70 lb felt a bit too heavy, so I went light.

Bird Dog: A bit rusty here. My balance was off, but settled into a bit after a couple of rounds.

Complex: 45 pounds, 95 pounds, and 115 pounds. These felt great.

Squats: Finished the set of 30 at 95 pounds without too much trouble, but definitely felt it.

Cool-down: Some shortish bar hangs, hip flexor stretches, and foam rolls.

04-11-19 06:45 PM - Post#880822    

Day 2

Bench: Finished both sets of 2-3-5, but it didn't feel easy. I expected it to, honestly, but it did not.

Bat Wings: Felt myself "slipping" just a tad near the end, but this was ok.

One-Arm Press: Both sets of 2-3-5 without too much trouble.

Bird Dog: Better than Day 1, but still felt a bit rusty.

Complexes: In order of sets: 95, 115, 135, 135, 135. Felt great! I was pleased by how well this went, as I remember the complexes being extremely difficult last time I went through.

Squats: Two sets of 30 at 95 pounds. Man, that second set barks. Your first few reps of the second set feel a bit strange, like your legs are swollen. Overall, not too bad.

MMS: The Journey Back
04-11-19 06:53 PM - Post#880824    

Day 3, 4/1/19

Starting weight: 201.8

Bench: All sets at 225. There was never any questions about finishing the reps, but it didn't feel light. Decided on 235 for next workout.

Bat Wings: All 10 sets with the 50s felt better than last time. I felt like I had good form throughout.

One Arm Press: All sets completed with the 53 with no issue. I'll be bumping up to 70 lb KB next time.

Bird Dog: This feels much better now. I feel balanced, and it is not difficult.

Complex: Did both sets at 135. Again, felt pretty good, but five reps on this is significantly more difficult than you might expect. It's not like going from 3 reps to 5 reps on the bench, because with six lifts you end up having to do 12 extra reps! And the amount of time under the bar goes up significantly. Still, it felt pretty good.

Squats: I messed up the instructions, and in my tired early-morning state put a 45 on the bar instead of a 25. Here the great part: I didn't notice until after I was done. So, I did the first set of 30 at 135 and then did the second at 95 instead of the 95 and 115 as prescribed. Not ideal, obviously, but not a huge difference. These felt surprisingly good.



Edited by Dex on 04-11-19 06:54 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

04-11-19 07:04 PM - Post#880825    

Day 4, 4/4/19

Starting weight: 204.6

Bench: 235 for both sets of 2-3-5, and then 10 reps at 225. Honestly, I was shocked. I may have even had one more in the tank, but it was close. I expected 8, but the bar just kept going up.

Bat Wings: Five 10 second holds with the 50s. This was harder. Not a strain, exactly, but it wasn't easy.

One Arm Press: 2-3-5 with the 70 lb KB. This was fine. Not super difficult, but I could definitely feel it.

Bird Dog: I'm old hat at this now. I aim for 3 set of 10 seconds on each side.

Complex: 135 for each set. Man, the presses were brutal. I think this is carryover from pressing more weight earlier in the workout, but having to strain on those presses makes it feel like you are getting crushed by the bar.

Squats: 3 sets of 30 at 115. Not fun, even though Dan notes that today is the end of the "fun".

Some thoughts:

I wrote in my notes that it is funny how perspective changes from when you are reading the program to when you are doing the program. Reading through the program, you see three sets of 30 at 115 and you think, "Hey, not so bad!" And you read further and you are like, "Jeez, we don't do a set of 50 at bodyweight until workout 8? It can't be that bad."

Then, when you are doing the program, by Day 4 you think, "We have to start squatting bodyweight for 50 reps at workout 8?!? Whoever designed this is insane."

No offense, Dan, if you read this.

04-11-19 07:10 PM - Post#880827    

Day 5, 4/7/18

Starting weight: 206.0

Bench: 235 for three sets of 2-3-5. This felt pretty heavy by the last set.

Bat Wings: I did not step up, as I was working pretty hard to get it right with the 50s. So, the holds here felt fine.

One Arm Press: Using the 70s again here, I felt good. But, like the bench, I could feel it by the last "5" on the 2-3-5s.

Bird Dog: Old hat!

Complex: 135 for each round. Folks, this was hard. Again, presses are the beast here, as I had to WORK to get them all.

Squats: 95x30, 115x30, and 135x30. I did not enjoy this. I found myself thinking, "Man, 135 for 50 will be nice next workout."

MMS: The Journey Back
04-11-19 07:25 PM - Post#880829    

Day 6, 4/10/19

Tweak: Protein before workout

Starting weight: 205.6

Bench: 235 again, 2-3-5 and then got 10 reps again. And, it felt great! I think I could have done a couple more. Again, I didn't think I had a chance to get 10, but the bar just kept moving. The remainder of the 2-3-5 was hard, with the last 5 feeling pretty tough.

Bat Wings: I tried the 70s, but I felt they were too heavy to stay tight, so I kept the 53s. Felt ok.

One Arm Press: Used the 70 lb KB again for three sets of 2-3-5. The last set was pretty tough. I kept this in mind for my complex weight choices.

Bird Dog: Old hat again!

Complex: Started at 115, then 135, 135, 135, and 95. It felt like I was getting crushed so really backed off on the last set. And really, it is the presses that get me. The other lifts don't bother me, but straining on the presses prevents breathing, and that makes that rest really difficult.

Squats: did the prescribed warmups and then 135 for 50. Remember last week when I thought it would be nice to just do one set of 50? That was stupid. This was terrible and made me question whether I can really still make it through this program at age 32.

Now, a day later, I can think a bit more clearly and realize that (1) I was moving faster through the workout because I was pressed for time and (2) sleep was not great the two nights leading up to this workout.

So, maybe I can make it! I don't know. I guess we will see soon enough. One thing to note is that last time I did this program, I had a good friend as a training partner. Man, I cannot understate the importance of that. Find someone you can compete with if at all possible, because doing this alone in your basement at 5:45 in the morning will seriously mess with your mind.

Next workout is scheduled for 4/13/19, but I may have reached the point at which an extra day of rest would be beneficial. I'll see how I feel recovery-wise, and I will report back.

I wish I could post an image (edit: it looks like I can but the editor crashes when I try to add) because I have a nifty graph showing heart rate through these workouts. This one on 4/10/19 is such clear delineation once I start complexes and then maxes out over 180 during my set of squats.

Edited by Dex on 04-11-19 07:32 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

04-12-19 01:00 AM - Post#880838    

I just finished this and am also 32! Don't get discouraged, looks like you got this! (I read your log as I went and it was inspiring, no reason you can't do it again.)

also I did THE EXACT SAME THING early on of accidentally lifting too much on the squat. Whoops. I'd suggest taking your time with the complexes. I'm now just messing around and it turns out I could've gone WAY heavier during the actual program if I had wanted to; ultimately I'm glad I didn't.

04-15-19 04:24 PM - Post#880935    

Thank bread man! That's a good suggestion on expanding rest times for complexes a bit; I did that this time around and it went much better. And nice work completing the program. It's a beast, and completing it, regardless of results, is an accomplishment in and of itself.

MMS: The Journey Back
04-15-19 04:45 PM - Post#880936    

Day 7 4/14/19

Starting weight: 208.8.

Bench: Max double for 295. This is very nearly an all-time best, which is particularly remarkable because in training for the Tactical Strength Challenge last spring, I pretty seriously irritated my biceps tendon in my shoulder. For those who have had this injury, you know that bench presses are nearly impossible. I was only able to start benching the bar about 6 months ago, and while rehab went very quickly in regaining strength, I never felt very close to being "back" in bench until now. So, naturally, I'm very pleased and excited to see where this goes.

Bat Wings: used the 50s again, and I have reached the point I feel that I could move up a bit on these.

One Arm Press: 70lb kettlebell for 2-3-5 sets. No real trouble, and the second "round" felt even better than the first.

Bird Dog: Tried to hold for 3 sets on each side at 15 seconds. Felt pretty good.

Complex: 135x5, 145x5, and 155x5. The 155 was a strain on the pressing front but felt so dramatically better than last workout that I realize a combination of poor sleep and compressed rest times had really affected me last time.

Squats: 115x10, 135x10, 185x10, 205x5, 205x5, 225x5, 225x5. This wasn't a big strain, but today, I do feel a bit of soreness. Overall though, I feel ready to tackle 225x50 next workout. That's not to say I think I will get all 50, but I feel ready to attack it. Here we go!

Cool-down: Lots of foam rolling.

Edited by Dex on 04-15-19 05:07 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

04-17-19 03:06 PM - Post#881005    

That one arm press is impressive. It's fun to watch it climb up.

Daniel John Just handing down what I was handed down... Make a Difference. Live. Love. Laugh. Balance work, rest, play and pray (enjoy beauty and solitude) Sleep soundly. Drink Water. Eat veggies and protein. Walk. Wear your seat belt. Don’t smoke. Floss your teeth. Put weights overhead. Pick weights off the floor. Carry weights. Reread great books. Say thank you

04-29-19 10:43 AM - Post#881524    

To preface: I know I am slow getting caught up, but it's not as slow as it seems. I wrote about three of these workouts on the morning that there were some technical difficulties that erased all of that mornings posts.

Dan, thanks. It's watching watching literally everything go up. It gives me thoughts about my long-term programming in general, but I'll expand on that when complete.

Day 8, 4/17/19

Starting weight: 208.8

Bench: 275 for five sets of 2. This felt pretty solid. Tough but never in doubt that I would get them.

Bat Wings: Used 70s, and really tried to squeeze.

One Arm Press: 2-3-5 with a 70. All good here.

Bird Dog: No prob!

Complex: 135, 145, 155, 165, 175. Presses on the last one were tough, but I got 'em!

Squats: 135x10, 185x3, 205x3, 225x31, 225x19. THERE IT IS. Man, what a beast these things are. I racked it after 31 and stumbled around the basement like a drunk. If you had asked me my first name, I'm not sure I would have remembered. My legs felt like jelly and my hearing got weird. Then, I had to do another 19 reps.

04-29-19 10:51 AM - Post#881525    

Day 9, 4/20/19

A quick preface: Diet and recovery took a slight hit here, as 4/19 was Good Friday. That's a day of fast for us Catholics. Additionally, I did a local Stations of the Cross that is a hike with decent elevation gain with a young child on my back. Obviously, this is not ideal for Dan's program. But, ya know, priorities.

Starting weight: 209

Bench: 275 for 5 sets of 3. Set three was a bit iffy, but I settled in and finished ok.

Bat Wings: 70s again, and it was tough.

One Arm Press: 3 sets of 2-3-5 with 70 lb. That last set was difficult.

Bird Dog: This was interesting. After thinking I was Mr. Bird Dog for a few workouts, I was off today. My balance was just not right, and I had to really focus to get them done well. It's possible that this is an indicator of poor recovery, which would make sense.

Complex: 3 sets of two reps at 175. It was ok! Presses were tough as usual, but I can't express how great it is to do two reps instead of five per complex.

Squats: 135x10, 185x10, 205x5, 225x5, 225x20. This was a needed "back-off" workout on these, and the timing was perfect.

04-29-19 10:56 AM - Post#881526    

Day 10, 4/23/19

Starting weight: 212.4

Bench: Slight discrepancy here: Log file says to do a set "up to 10" after the first 2-3-5, but the book does not. I followed the book.

2-3-5x2 at 275 pounds. All good! The second set of 5 felt better than the first as I settled into the groove. Really, this is 20 reps at 275 pounds on bench. I couldn't have fathomed that at the outset of this program.

Bat Wings: 70s, felt ok.

One Arm Press: 70 for 2-3-5. All good. Maybe even easy.

Bird Dog: Felt much better this time around!

Complex: 175 for five sets of two. Those presses are a struggle, but the load is manageable. I'd even go so far as to say it was fun. Note: not easy, but fun.

Squats: 135x10, 185x3, 205x10, 225x32, 225x18. I know Dan says not to set your sights on a given number, but had I not gone for "at least" beating the last number I did, I wouldn't have made it this far. Brutal! And then I did 18 more.

04-29-19 11:03 AM - Post#881527    

Day 11, 4/26/19

Starting weight: 214.4

Bench: Max double at 315. That's an all-time PR. Amazing and exciting!

Bat Wings: So, today I actually used a timer. Did you know that time goes slower when doing bat wings? I realized that my "10 second holds" were closer to 7 seconds, and when I did ten, 70s were a struggle. I backed down to 50s so that I could complete the reps the way I am supposed to.

One Arm Press: 2-3-5 with 70s. All good.

Bird Dog: All good!

Complex: Today, reps were stepped up to 5. 135 for the first set, then 175 for the second two. And, forgive me, I could not complete the presses on the last set. I did three and then moved to the next lift. Please understand that the time under load at 5 reps per lift is far more difficult than you think it would be compared to 2 reps per lift. My notes here say "-three reps on press because I was getting crushed."

Squats: 135x10, 185x3, 205x10, 225x35, 225x15

The squats felt a little bit better! I remember hitting 30 previously and thinking I was about to collapse. I didn't quite feel that way this time, so I did 35. Still brutal.

04-29-19 11:11 AM - Post#881528    

4/29/19, Weight: 216.2

Today I should be doing another workout, but I am adding a day of rest. Doing my "recharge" workout yesterday was weirdly difficult. All of my (very light) lifts felt very heavy. It was just hard to move around. Going up stairs left me with a deep burn in the thighs. Holding my sons felt like they had gained 25 pounds. Typing on the computer was hard.

Taking all of these things together, I'm taking an extra day to recover. Today I do feel better than I felt yesterday, so hopefully I'm on track to get it done tomorrow.

It does get me wondering "why". I only did 3 more reps in squats on my first set than last time. The max double in bench felt ok. Sleep and nutrition were pretty solid. I don't feel sick.

It leaves me thinking that the complexes were particularly impactful. I really did feel like I was getting crushed, and I was pretty fried after attempting those presses.

One other thing: Check out that weight gain. I started out this program at 200 pounds, and now I'm up to 216. Wow!

05-02-19 09:11 AM - Post#881710    

Day 12, 4/30/19

Starting weight: 215.2

Bench: 295 for five sets of two. Not easy, but never close to failing.

Bat Wings: 70s for five sets of 5 second holds. The five second holds went pretty well. I don't think I can do 10 second holds yet, but it was better than before.

One Arm Press: 70s for three sets of 2-3-5. All good!

Bird Dog: Knees all the way together now, and it feels good.

Complex: 175 for three sets of three reps. Presses were hard as usual, but I was able to complete all the reps. I'm definitely making progress here.

Squats: 135x10, 185x3, 205x40, 205x10. I'm getting closer! Fifty is just around the corner.

05-05-19 04:38 PM - Post#881906    

Day 13, 5/3/19

Starting weight: 216.8

Bench: Five sets of three at 295 pounds. That's an all-time best. I got all reps, but the last rep of the last set was a grind.

Bat Wings: Used 50s here and really focused on staying tight.

One Arm Press: The log says to try to move to a heavier weight, though that advice is absent in the main book pages. As I only have a 70 lb and an 88 lb kettlebell, I had to make a big jump to move up. Since the 70 was feeling pretty easy, I thought, "What the heck? I'll just try the 88 for the first set and move down if I need to." Well, I ended up doing all three sets of 2-3-5 with the 88. That's easily an all-time best in the one arm press. I was blown away.

Bird Dog: Kept legs pressed together, and good three sets of 10 seconds. I felt good.

Complex: I used 185 here, mostly because 175 felt fine last time and 185 is a lot easier to put on the bar than 175. I got them all. That matches an all-time best for this lift.

Squats: 135x10, 185x3, 205x3, 225x10, 205x42, and 205x8. By this point, I realized I was having the best workout of my life with PRs across the board, and I thought to myself, "Don't blow this. Get 50 with 205." Well, I couldn't do it. I got to 42 and my legs started shaking bad enough that I was concerned I was going to collapse. I lift alone in my basement, so I racked it.

All in all, I meant what I said. This is the best weight room workout of my life. I've never put up these kind of numbers. I know, there are many in the forum for whom these weights are fairly pedestrian, but for me, this is major progress. I know I didn't get the 205 for 50, but I don't want to detract from the rest of the workout. And, I have one more chance.

I'm going to perform that final workout on Tuesday the 7th. Wish me luck.

And oh yeah, the mass part? I weighed in at 218 this morning. I started this thing at 200.

07-23-19 12:32 PM - Post#885258    

Very nice, Dex. I remember your first run through this back in the day -- very nice on round 2!

07-24-19 11:23 AM - Post#885298    

205 x 42...impressive.

Daniel John Just handing down what I was handed down... Make a Difference. Live. Love. Laugh. Balance work, rest, play and pray (enjoy beauty and solitude) Sleep soundly. Drink Water. Eat veggies and protein. Walk. Wear your seat belt. Don’t smoke. Floss your teeth. Put weights overhead. Pick weights off the floor. Carry weights. Reread great books. Say thank you

07-28-19 02:06 PM - Post#885460    

Really cool Dex, great lifting and solid weight gain 💪

Owen Brown, a Biomedical Scientist from Pontyclun, Wales.