09-02-21 04:01 AM - Post#912990    

I did some "training log mining" recently and was reminded that I tend to get very tight lower back on the right side of the spine. I also strain it on that side few times a year, typically during squats.

My right leg is 10 mm (0.4 inches) longer than left, both anatomical and functional length, which was measured by a very good sports physio back in 2012. I tried plastic shoe inserts, but strained my upper back / neck during a Jerk, so I gave up on the idea. But since mining the log and reading this article I came back wondering if I should try a shoe lift again.

I dislike heel lifts; it seems to fix the problem only when you stand on your full foot (but of course the ankle is now at a different angle). But what happens with quick lifts when you are on your toes? Does it even matter?

Full length plastic shoe inserts make the shoe box too tight. I also tried finding a cobbler but the ones I've asked nearby don't modify WL shoes.

Using an extra 10 mm rubber mat on the floor would work with slower lifts, so that's something I could try. Or modifying the shoe myself, but I'm not entirely sure how to do that.

Few months ago I started experimenting with wearing two different WL shoes, so the right one has lower heel and I also removed the inside sole. That made up the difference near the heel, if not 10 mm then very close to it.

And yes, I strained my lower back again on the right side after few months of moderate lifting. Nothing crazy.

But then I started wondering about staggered stance. I've seen the Klokov video and also re-read the above article, which also mentions it.

It's funny, if I don't look at my feet and do a Goblet Squat, my right foot is slightly forward and it feels more comfortable (longer femur?). I suspect that is the natural stance for me in a squat position. But when I do barbell squats, I've been quite strict about having the feet at same level. Now I'm wondering if I should try both shoe lift and a slightly staggered stance (right foot forward). I'm wondering if this would work with both squats and pulls?

Has anyone else had similar issues / revelations? Did you end up using a full length shoe lift, staggered stance or both?

Sorry for a rambling post.

My workout log

Leg length discrepancy and staggered stance
09-02-21 06:45 AM - Post#912992    

My left (lower) leg is 10 mm shorter, I’m also long legged short torso, I use exercises now that don’t irritate my body, it took some to to figure that out as soon as I believed it wasn’t necessary to squat with a barbell as much as I enjoyed it, it was causing grief I’m lucky to own a collection of interesting equipment I’m sorry I’m not that helpful but it’s a personal thing where you just need to find and settle on exercise that provides good ROM and where you can go real hard safely.

Nice legs-shame about the face

Edited by Andy Mitchell on 09-02-21 06:49 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

09-02-21 06:48 AM - Post#912993    

The shoes I wear are ones with no heel, like minimus, Nike metcons and sneakers, in fact I wear metcons all day, and thongs when I can, especially in the summer months

Nice legs-shame about the face

09-02-21 07:02 AM - Post#912995    

• Andy Mitchell Said:

Thanks, Andy. Yes, maybe I need to reassess about barbell lifts. I did start learning the ATG split squat recently and I've done Bulgarian split squats in the past when giving the back a rest.

It would be quite cool to learn the split style olympic lifts, which might be easier on my back, but I'm not sure about knees.

I wear minimal heels during warm-up, kettlebell lifts, walking, etc. (Vibram Five Fingers or Merrell Trail Glove).

My workout log

Leg length discrepancy and staggered stance
09-02-21 10:54 AM - Post#913003    

I have a similar leg length discrepancy, where my left leg is slightly longer than my right. I broke my lower left leg when I was 9, and I don't know if the doctor didn't set the cast right, or if it's just a bad time to have broken leg when you're growing so much.

Anyway, I've experimented with lifts in my shoes, and I feel like the results have been mixed. I eventually just gave up on it, because as long as I was strength training, I seemed to have fewer low back/lower body issues. Plus, I feel like the body adapts over the years in so many ways (different movement patterns at different angles) that a simple heel lift isn't going to fix it,

When I do the jump test, my right foot is slightly turned out to the side more than my left foot. This tends to be my preferred squat set up, but I don't really know if it's better to do that or if I should force symmetry. When I'm paying attention, I kind of split the difference between a symmetrical stance and the "foot more turned out" stance. I have had minor issues here and there, but no major issues.

As I've gotten into my late 30s (and I'm now 40), I've had more issues whenever I've upped my squatting volume. Earlier this year I was doing Dan's easy strength for olympic lifting - decent volume, but light loads - and my left low back down to my glute was giving me fits.

All that to say, I'm now mainly doing ATG split squats, VMO squats, and goblet squats at lighter weights. I'm not sure when/if I'll go back to squatting with any decent volume/weight as long as I can do other activities (running, chasing my kids) injury-free.



Edited by dlannan on 09-02-21 10:55 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

09-02-21 11:01 AM - Post#913006    

Yes, significant discrepancy leading to scoliosis.

I got given shims and all that lifting under Rippetoe's supervision, tried it for a while and didn't like it much.

When I do Easy Strength I never get hurt. Going over 80%, well that's a different matter.

Athletic Club East Strength in numbers

09-02-21 12:06 PM - Post#913013    

• Kyle Aaron Said:

100%

I’ve got a giant 1-inch difference, thanks to a fused, half-metal ankle. The only way I can squat is with squat shoes and a very narrow duck-footed stance, wearing a custom insert for the bad ankle. But once I go above 80%, the damndest stuff starts happening all across my back. Scapula, lumbar, thoracic, something ALWAYS gets screwy around the 5th week.

Never happens with Easy Strength. And yet, the weights go up.

Re: Leg length discrepancy and staggered stance
09-02-21 05:33 PM - Post#913029    

• Ville Said:

Have you considered becoming a 200m runner? Be grateful it's the right!

09-02-21 07:15 PM - Post#913032    

• Andy Mitchell Said:

I'm wearing a thong right now in your honor Andy.

Mark it Zero.

09-02-21 07:53 PM - Post#913033    

Make sure it’s the right way around

Nice legs-shame about the face

09-03-21 12:00 AM - Post#913036    

• Andy Mitchell Said:

Banana Hammock

Mark it Zero.

09-03-21 12:25 AM - Post#913037    

Budgie smuggler

Nice legs-shame about the face

09-03-21 02:40 AM - Post#913039    

• Jordan D Said:

Thanks, Kyle and Jordan. I read from another thread that deadlifts helped with your back issues, Jordan. What kind of shoes / stance do you use with deadlifts?

My workout log

Re: Leg length discrepancy and staggered stance
09-03-21 02:43 AM - Post#913041    

• Old Miler Said:

* scribbling notes furiously * 200m running, Easy Strength, thong, ... I think I've got enough to go with now.

My workout log

09-03-21 03:03 AM - Post#913042    

Not really into numbers or comparison
I go on about it but it really is a personal endeavour it’s a serious opportunity to learn about yourself, you’re doing this FOR YOU, the real good stuff is you’re just “doing” and to find what works means you can do it real hard, and change is real fast… testing yourself knowing your limits and limitations.

Being tied down to what some experts tell you to use is ok it works for them could for you too,

Nice legs-shame about the face

09-03-21 03:35 AM - Post#913043    

• Andy Mitchell Said:

Thanks, Andy. I've never really been in the boat where I could just follow a program to the letter, for example, add 2.5kg to the bar until you squat 1.5x bodyweight. Something breaks well before that, so I've had to learn to adapt and accept that it just doesn't work for me. If you ask anyone online, you're just not "working hard enough" or "we told you it's simple, not easy".

I've given this some thought recently. If you deviate from some program, you're a snowflake, because you think you're special in some way. But it really is genes and environment again, in a different way, other people were lucky, but you just happen to have different length bones. This does make you special, so you have to adapt otherwise you keep getting injured. Well, if that makes me a snowflake or "uncoachable" then I'll take it as a compliment. It means I have a brain and I can use it.

My workout log

09-03-21 03:40 AM - Post#913044    

A lot of experts just look for the perfect protocol they’re fools

Nice legs-shame about the face

09-03-21 12:54 PM - Post#913063    

• Ville Said:

Chuck Ts, narrow-ish conventional stance. Lifting shoes shove me forward, which is bad news for my back. Sumo might be better but I can’t do it because of hip impingement. Also, I tend to drop the barbell off-center because of the leg discrepancy, which seems like bad news, but by keeping the weight modest in ES style my back and hamstrings seem to have adjusted and grown stronger than ever.