04-26-21 07:54 AM - Post#909883    

Howdy my son is starting his third year of Australian Rules Football, and if you haven’t seen it before, believe me it is a tough, high contact game played with no padding or protection.

He’s got a real eye and mind for the game and great speed and skill - better than most in his group- but he is as skinny as a boy can be and also has hyper mobility in his elbows - his arms out “straight” are actually bent a little the wrong way. It’s never been an issue for him and I don’t want it to become one. I’m hoping a little muscle mainly in the biceps and triceps will help with this.

I think 8 is probably too young for any real strength or weights work? But I was thinking of getting him a relatively heavy slam ball to play with.

Could that be a reasonable option?

He’s probably around 30kg bodyweight and I was thinking something in the region of 8-10kg for him to practice deadlifting, maybe shouldering, chucking around etc and bear hug carrying for a few minutes a few times a week?

I’m trying to encourage rather than force him to do anything he doesn’t want to do. He absolutely loves playing but I am concerned once the season starts next week he is going to find this next level, where some contact and tackling is allowed, is a struggle when he is less well built than some of the kids.

Any other suggestions welcomed also please

Log

04-26-21 08:13 AM - Post#909884    

My boy is the same age and dap and is just going into proper tackling in his rugby. I'm not sure he needs anything further than playing the game to build armour tbh? But if have got him doing some basic strength calisthenics - even the best players on his team can't do what I call a proper push up

04-26-21 10:50 AM - Post#909889    

Farmer's Walk/Sled Drag combo then push-up position planks.

Mark it Zero.

04-26-21 01:15 PM - Post#909891    

I’ve seen those push up position planks (PUPP) thrown around this forum a lot. What’s the rationale behind those? Building anterior strength across the whole chain and building up stabilizing shoulder musculature in the way only push-ups can? Just do several 30s-1min holds?

04-26-21 01:18 PM - Post#909892    

I think a little force is in order, but only toward the consumption of whole milk and PBJs.

04-26-21 01:51 PM - Post#909895    

I remember when my son went from tag rugby, which he excelled at, to starting tackling. They were all tiny. He got his fingers bent backwards a few times too often, watched at least one kid each week get a nasty bang and end up in tears or being taken off while they were checked out, and he ended up deciding round balls were safer and more fun. Hard to fault the logic.

Sadly I don't think there's a lot you can do to make them bulk up at that age. Most active kids are already eating everything in sight and it's making no difference at all. But they can probably get stronger and get good at falling and rolling.

Our kids' rugby coach was adamant that if you "go in hardest", the other kid gets hurt and not you. Not entirely sure that's a good message to give them but maybe it helped select the right club team for 10 years down the road!

04-26-21 03:21 PM - Post#909899    

I like your idea of the slam ball. My three-year-old usually tags along while I workout and he loves to play with the our medicine ball – picking it up, carrying it, throwing/slamming it, etc. Whenever he’s had enough he moves on and does something else, but I enjoy the company and hope he’s getting the message that exercise is fun/interesting and a good habit for life. Really that's all your trying to do at this point.

Armour building for 8 year old
04-26-21 04:02 PM - Post#909900    

Crawling....

A more detailed response would involve:
Forwards, backwards, sideways, axis....uphill backwards and forwards....downhill backwards and forwards.

If he wants - do any and/or all of the above using a sled....bands, sand bag etc etc.

Or games like Crawl-ball.

Richard

Edited by Ricky01 on 04-26-21 04:07 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

04-26-21 04:17 PM - Post#909901    

My boy loves having a go at sprinting with the sled.

04-27-21 04:14 AM - Post#909907    

He's 8. Just let him play.

If you think he risks injury in a sport at 8 years old, don't let him do the sport, choose something less destructive.

Athletic Club East Strength in numbers

04-27-21 04:50 AM - Post#909908    

• Kyle Aaron Said:

Happy to let him play it - but after a couple of sessions of preseason training with his own team it's clear that some - not all - of the other kids are a bit heavier than he is.

Being the relatively high-contact sport that it is, I'm more worried about his confidence being shattered than anything else.

Log

04-27-21 07:59 AM - Post#909916    

Bodyweight stuff - push ups, chin-ups, planks, crawls, animal walks, carries. Just make it a game you play together. Keep it fun and don’t worry too much about technique. There’s no fun in being corrected all the time.

04-27-21 09:12 AM - Post#909918    

• Kyle Aaron Said:

This is my thought, too, for what that may be worth.

Armour building for 8 year old
04-27-21 10:36 AM - Post#909921    

• BrianBinVA Said:

+1. I was small for my age. I tried judo for a few months around that age, got flattened once by someone much larger and never went back...

Check out my critical-thinking blog at sharpenyouraxe.substack.com

Edited by RupertC on 04-27-21 10:43 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

Re: Armour building for 8 year old
04-27-21 01:26 PM - Post#909926    

• RupertC Said:

+2, though I lean towards “just let the kids play.”

04-27-21 03:48 PM - Post#909931    

Another vote for let him play. Have him try a few other sports, play with his mates, ride his bike, mow your lawn :)

Training Blog.

04-27-21 06:12 PM - Post#909936    

I was a skinny and weak kid.
At 18 I was 6 foot and 140.
8 seems early for special training.
Has he tried other sports.

04-27-21 06:37 PM - Post#909938    

I’m not sure armor building would be my primary concern here, and I’m not passing any judgment or drawing any conclusions. I just figured I’d offer a different point of view from the other side of the planet after having raised four active kids.

When I used to teach geography to middle schoolers, I had a collection of YouTube videos I’d show. One was this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHwffmPdou0
It’s pretty much my entire exposure to Australian Rules Football.

Students always thought the video was cool, but I can’t recall anyone thinking it was a good idea to actually play. At one point I decided to show this video to my wife. With the combination of contact and borderline out-of-control sprinting, she didn’t understand how someone could let their kid play. She’s also a physical therapist.

I have two sons, both now in their early 30s. One played soccer in high school, and one wanted to play American football when he was in ninth grade. I’m 6’, 1” and usually in the low 170s. My wife, a physical therapist, is 5’, 8” and usually around 125. In ninth grade the son who wanted to play football was 6’ 3” and about 150 with average speed on a good day. Mom and dad said no to football, and life went on.

One of my daughters went through the grades playing soccer, basketball, and lacrosse with the best athlete I’d seen in town. The parents of this girl had her stop playing soccer in middle school when she had a hamstring injury. They did their homework, including checking with college athletic trainers, and concluded their daughter’d be better off not playing soccer. She switched to field hockey in ninth grade, and despite never playing the sport until preseason was starting on the varsity team as a freshman. She went on to play field hockey, basketball, and lacrosse at a D III school.

My very limited research on Australian Rules Football yielded these:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/26/sports/afl -football-concussions.html

https://www.richmondrehab.com.au/blog/physiotherapy%20/ injuries-in-australian-ru les-football
From the concluding paragraph: “In Summary, if we look at the statistics for the game of Australian Rules Football, it is highly likely that you may sustain an injury of some sort through the season requiring you to miss one or more matches.”

04-27-21 10:14 PM - Post#909942    

When I was in primary school in the late 1970s/early 1980s, we played Australian Rules in a little country town out in the wheat belt region of Western Australia called Dalwallinu. The oval we played on was mostly gravel. Around the edge of it there was quite a lot of Afghan thistle and doublegees. So if you got tackled over the boundary you were at risk of landing in them. Between the gravel rash, the thistles/prickles and being tackled by kids a couple of years older than you, it was a pretty tough day. Good times.

At some point, somebody decided that maybe the kids should play on the big oval that had actual grass and no thistles. Luxury.

04-27-21 10:50 PM - Post#909944    

Cool topic, begs the question about what makes a good set of activities for kids more generally.

My completely unqualified list is (assuming they actually want to do it): gymnastics, wrestling/ rough-housing, swimming*, whatever different sports and actual work (chores).

* all Australian kids should be half-decent swimmers, for safety if nothing else.

04-28-21 04:36 AM - Post#909947    

There was an ABC article here recently about a 14yo girl who was quitting AFL after her fifth concussion.

At 14 years old.

Sport has many benefits. But the effect of starting earlier just seems to be getting injured earlier. Instead of netballers (for example) getting ACL repairs at 25, they get them at 15. It's not clear to me that an early start benefits anyone long-term.

Well, I suppose it benefits the guys offering "elite under-10s soccer camps" and stuff like that...

Athletic Club East Strength in numbers

04-28-21 07:13 AM - Post#909948    

I have been following this forum for around 15 years but haven't felt the need to comment until this. I was born in Dalwallinu. Such a small world.

In regard to the original question. I played a bit of AFL in my youth & again as an adult. I wasn't any good so can't offer much advice but I would suggest playing with your son including tackling and wrestling (obviously adjusted for his size). He may build some strength like the country footballers who are forced to play against adults as teenagers. Worst case scenario is that it doesn't help his size or strength but ends up with some great memories.

04-28-21 09:35 AM - Post#909951    

To expand a bit on what I wrote before, I think it is very tough to decide what is a good idea when they are that age. And doubly so with what I would call "cultural" sports of this kind, like American football if you live in Texas, or Aussie Rules or rugby if you live somewhere those are big and everybody seems to play. I'm guessing a lot of his friends from school play also?

Also to follow up on an earlier response, has he tried/does he like other sports? Maybe one of the other cultural-type things that isn't quite so contact-biased? Cricket? Swimming? Tennis?

04-28-21 12:21 PM - Post#909956    

• BrianBinVA Said:

He plays at school but honestly although AFL is huuuge here and a massive part of the culture, he simply saw it on tv one day and just instantly fell in love with it and wanted to play.

That was when he was five, and too young to join the junior league (Auskick), but we played at home and yeah he played a bit at school but mostly he just wanted to watch it - as much as he could and at any level (local, national, mens and women’s).


We signed him up to Auskick as soon as he was old enough and from day one, coaches, other teams coaches, parents etc have commented that they can see he loves the game and is a lot more skilled than many/most in his age.

I haven’t forced any of it on him or pressured him to play - if anything all we’ve done is try to stop him going too crazy on it and made sure he realises that - although he could one day play professionally if he worked hard at it, and at school, and still wanted too when he’s older - that there is a big chance it might never happen.

After his first season of Auskick ended we suggested he might want to try another sport over summer, and as is pretty common here, he got into cricket on TV and wanted to try that. So again after playing at home and the park we signed him up for junior cricket.

I’m not sure where he got his genes from because before long it was obvious to us, and again other parents and coaches, that he’s pretty bloody good at that too!

Don’t get me wrong I don’t think he’s some child prodigy, but amongst dozens of kids on his teams and clubs it’s always been clear that he wants to be there more than many, who’s parents are just trying to get them out of the house, and who have no real interest in the sports.

So it’s probably a pretty fine line between just letting him play, and encouraging (not pushing) him to really make the most of his love of the game and his skills and seemingly pretty natural sporting ability.

The season of proper junior AFL starts this weekend. It’s a modified rules from the senior game and there is tackling, but no hard contact or brining the player down to the ground, so we will see what happens.

Well, I definitely will as I’ve agreed to be one of the official umpires, eek

Log

04-28-21 12:24 PM - Post#909957    

• Matt Gilly Said:

Thanks mate, yeah I’m helping out with the coaching and although his season starts this weekend, we’ll be working more on the (modified) tackling in the weeks to come.

But yeah I might also do some one on one drills with him at home sometimes. He also plays at school every day of course

Log

Armour building for 8 year old
04-28-21 12:27 PM - Post#909958    

I wouldn't worry about strength training at such a young age. Just make sure he gets plenty of good food and sleep.

I know that as an athletic father of an athletic child it's tempting to coach or train him. However, I think you should just focus on being his dad.

"My grandma Olga, a famous Finnish Powerlifter, once told me, 'Little one, take care of your gastrointestinal tract and it'll take care of you.' Then she struck me with some salted herring." - TC Luoma

Edited by The Finn on 04-28-21 12:29 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

04-28-21 03:47 PM - Post#909964    

• Dan Christensen Said:

Not just Australian. When I was growing up in the UK, this was just basic - what happens if you fall in a river or canal? Everyone made sure you could swim - schools, parents, whatever. I am truly shocked when I meet someone who cannot swim.

Any Brits remember the old Amateur Swimming Association water survival badges? If you could tread water for X minutes, drag a pal to the edge of the pool, swim a mile and make a float out of your pajamas (because we are always wearing pajamas when we fall in, right?) you got Gold and some bragging rights. Usually in a freezing cold pool because school term ended in early June.

Re: Armour building for 8 year old
05-13-21 08:14 PM - Post#910334    

• aussieluke Said:

I definitely get your concern -- although, I was in the opposite boat. My son (playing hockey) was always on the bigger side. But, of course, we had friends on the team that were on the smaller side. And it was always a concern.

I have two specific and one general thought. The specific stuff is: wrestling and tumbling. They could come in many forms.

If you have a good judo school that works with kids (and there could be other options as well), that would be great wrestling exposure which has the two-fold benefit of lots of multi-directional-strengt h *and* physical contact. It would also include some basic tumbling which gets you used to hitting the ground (as do the throws). Another way to get at tumbling would be gymnastics. There are so many valuable skills there, including mastering bodyweight.

Of course, these don't need to be organized ... but it does help, particularly with judo (and BJJ, or whatever is close to you and high quality), to have a partner your size! The gymnastics and general tumbling could be in a field and on a playground.

The general recommendation is "play games" (not a big shocker with kids!). But, you can be creative and give them a twist. I'm thinking stuff like Hooverball (volleyball with throwing and catching and returning a medicine ball) -- but scaled for a youngster. Or just wrestling with dad. Or make up your own hybrid of European football + rugby/aussie/gaelic football that involves lots of agility, tackling, and laughter. I did that with my son. I think we actually have videos from about 10 years ago where we explained the rules. Those are some precious memories!

Good luck!

Best,
Mark

Re: Armour building for 8 year old
05-14-21 02:30 AM - Post#910338    

• Mark Fenner Said:

Judo has given my eldest boy the advantages described above (he isn't afraid of falling), plus his one on one footwork in the rugby context is much better for exposure to a combat sport- there's a lot to be said for agility as a body shield.

05-14-21 02:24 PM - Post#910346    

Interesting thread.

I have a 7 year old. He does goblet squats, pushups, swings and pullups (just got his first deadhang, he was incredibly proud!) a couple times a week with me in the garage. We just have fun together, nothing super structured, just keeping it playful and enjoyable.

It is incredible what having fun in the garage with kettlebells and a pair of rings, digging, climbing, gardening and playing outside and a solid diet of meat, veggies, potatoes and milk will do in a short amount of time to a growing boy.

play hard, get outside, eat 3 square a day and go to bed tuckered out.

05-18-21 08:05 AM - Post#910450    

Cavery said:

• Quoting:

The time with our kids is priceless!

Best,
Mark

05-18-21 11:29 AM - Post#910456    

Thanks everyone got your inputs

At 3 weeks into the season, everything seems to be going ok so far. He’s holding his own strength-wise and the game itself has been surprisingly good for their level, and they’ve all taken well to the modified tackling rules - ie much less physical contact than the full adult game rules.

Also each week both teams are required to provide a qualified parent field umpire - so I took the course and have umpired the first three games - no other parent from our team volunteered or took the course, so it will be me every week for the foreseeable future. Although it was daunting at first - mostly due to the potential to ruin the game for either team, or to have conflicts with parents etc, it’s been great so far with no issues. It’s also extremely fun but hard work keeping up with 30 8-year-olds over a 100m x 50m oval field for 4 x 15 minute quarters!

Log